...it's like TV Tropes, but LINKED DATA!
Good Versus Good
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It's hard to create a story where both sides are fully sympathetic and yet in a real conflict with each other. This is not when the characters on both sides are somewhat sympathetic, merely believe in their own actions without being fully sympathetic, or are in a temporary conflict by mistake. No, this is when both sides are unambiguously Good and locked in a real conflict with each other. This can be a philosophical struggle where Lawful Good and For Great Justice stand against the forces of Chaotic Good and For Happiness. In this case, the conflict is often between a Hero Protagonist and a Hero Antagonist; which is which depends on from whose perspective the story is being told (with Chaotic Good usually as the protagonist in democratic societies). It can also be when unambiguously good characters find themselves on different sides of a Grey-and-Gray Morality conflict. In either case, they are often reluctant to fight each other but can have a hard time understanding each other's point. Expect to find one or more Always Lawful Good races in such stories. This can tie into the philosophical struggle of what it means to be "good". As such, it can overlap with To Be Lawful or Good, where the conflict is doing the morally correct thing vs. following the ethically correct rules. Compare with Both Sides Have a Point, Idealist vs. Pragmatist, Your Terrorists Are Our Freedom Fighters, Utopia Justifies the Means, Fighting Your Friend (assuming both are good) and Let's You and Him Fight. Contrast to Black-and-White Morality and Evil Versus Evil. |
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The conflict between Team Flash and Gypsy in The Flash. Gypsy is an interdimentional cop who was trying to catch a criminal that just happened to be friends with Team Flash. No-one in the story was really evil and conflict was ultimately resolved peacefully. | |
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With Great Power Comes Great Insanity | |
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The only real life-threatening situation in a long time has been the last stage of Subterranean Animism where defeat would have cause the protagonist to fall into the Hell of Blazing Fires, only because the final boss (Utsuho Reiuji) went temporarily crazy. | |
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Shoot the Dog | |
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Although the good side not controlled by the player is generally more "ends justify the means," and willing to employ genuinely evil in their pursuit of noble goals. Usually if both sides are completely good, the Lawful Good faction is, uniquely for an RPG series, the one in the right, though most times both factions already are Lawful Good at their core. | |
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Humiliating Wager | |
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In Lucha Libre feds, one of the most common causes of this trope is the "Parejas Suicidas" match, where two "parejas" or tag teams face off and the losing teammates must then fight one another, the loser of the resulting one on one contest having to unmask or shave their head. CMLL has an annual "cage of death" where two teams compete to escape the structure but only the last person out has to remove a mask or go bald, which can result in a similar outcome should the rudos leave two tecnicos in. These types of "gambling matches" are some of the rare places where heel vs heel (rudo contro rudo?) is more common though. | |
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Trauma Button | |
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Volume 7 is full of conflict between people who should be allies. Thanks to the villains turning Atlas and Mantle against each other, on top of an historic wealth divide between the two cities, Ironwood and the Ace-Ops are pitted against Robyn and her Huntress team. The heroes enter this conflict initially on Ironwood's side, but are sympathetic to Mantle and encourage Ironwood to join forces with Robyn. Eventually, they do all come together to protect Mantle from invasion and capture Watts and Tyrian. Cinder then presses Ironwood's Trauma Button, sending him into a villainous spiral for the climax of Volume 7, that pits him and the Ace-Ops against the heroes and Robyn due to his decision to abandon Mantle and Remnant and fly Atlas to safety. In Volume 8, he becomes a full Arc Villain and his decision to bomb Mantle to bring the heroes into line results in most of Ace-Ops turning against him, too. | |
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Sitcom Arch-Nemesis | |
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The conflict between team RWBY and their allies on one side and Cordovin with her forces on the other. The protagonists seek to take the Relic of Knowledge to Atlas and, after being denied entrance through the border, decide to steal a military aircraft and fly to Atlas illegally. Cordovin, not knowing the full importance of their mission and being blinded by her hatred towards her Sitcom Arch-Nemesis Maria Calavera, tries to stop them and resorts to rather excessive means in doing so. The resulting battle draws a horde of Grimm towards Argus, forcing both sides to set their conflict aside and fight to protect the city instead. Afterwards, Ruby apologises on behalf of her group for the trouble caused and Cordovin decides to let them leave for Atlas in peace. | |
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Nice Job Breaking It, Hero! | |
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The fight between Brienne of Tarth and the Hound in Season 4. They are both trying to protect the same person, and are two of the only characters with genuinely selfless motives, but because they fight to both of their near deaths they leave Arya Stark completely unaccompanied. | |
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Eldritch Abomination | |
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Touhou 7 does have a tree Eldritch Abomination, the Saigyou Ayakashi, which kills people by forcing them to sleep until they die. It would have been released from the seal keeping it in check if the "Big Bad", Yuyuko, had succeeded with her plan to lift said seal. However, Yuyuko herself avoids being evil despite her goal: she didn't know the tree to be evil (she just wanted to see its legendary beauty), and lifting the seal would have killed her permanently (she's a Cute Ghost Girl) since she happens to be the key. When she realizes exactly what the Saigyou Ayakashi is as well as why and how it was sealed, she immediately calls the plan off. | |
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Heel–Face Revolving Door | |
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The X-Men vs Avengers crossover back in the '80s, where the two teams were fighting over the fate of Magneto, who at the time had reformed and joined the X-Men. The Avengers — who generally turn a blind eye to the X-Men's actions since they know the mutants are heroes — wanted to bring a known terrorist to justice, while the X-Men wanted to protect their ally. It happened again in 2012 (as Avengers vs. X-Men this time); now over Hope Summers, who was expected to become the next host of the Phoenix Force. The X-Men again want to protect one of their own, while the Avengers see the Phoenix as a potential threat (not without cause, mind you). However, this premise was discarded once the Phoenix actually arrived, as the handful of X-Men that the Phoenix took as hosts (since Hope was incapacitated) started Jumping Off the Slippery Slope, with even Cyclops eventually becoming a Knight Templar. (The Avengers aren't completely innocent either, but like in Civil War they're still Designated Heroes at the very least.) Just prior to the latter scrap with the Avengers, the X-Men (mainly Cyclops and Wolverine) fought amongst themselves in Schism over whether or not the younger members should be involved when the group faces life-or-death battles. |
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All-Loving Hero | |
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A three-sided version happened when Faith came to Los Angeles. Angel wanted to redeem her, Buffy wanted to send her to prison, and the Watchers Council wanted to kill her because she was too dangerous. It arguably became a four-sided version when the cops got involved, though while the LAPD as a whole wanted to arrest Faith because she was wanted for murder, Kate was being manipulated by Wolfram & Hart to use Faith as a thinly veiled excuse to persecute Angel for reasons that made no sense. | |
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Always Lawful Good | |
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Somewhat oddly, the creators deliberately tried to avert this trope in 4th edition, making several creatures that were Always Lawful Good in past editions "unaligned" (basically 4th edition's version of True Neutral), most notably, metallic dragons, angels, and couatls. The creators themselves stated the reason was they figured most players would play good or unaligned with a tilt towards good characters, and thus would be unlikely to want to fight good monsters, even though obviously good people can fight and disagree. Thankfully, they changed them all back in 5th edtion. | |
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Face–Heel Turn | |
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The Rock still wasn't the "villain" per se; the crowd just didn't cheer for him, at least not at first. The match is actually a good example of why this trope is so rare, since the fans didn't seem to know how to react to the Rock, since against anyone else, or in any other state, they would be cheering for him too. Also, near the end of the match when it was clear what side Austin was on, the crowd did start cheering on The Rock, and gave him a massive ovation the last time he kicked out of Austin's savage beating. | |
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Hilarious in Hindsight | |
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Also counts as Hilarious in Hindsight The two "not enemies"? Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels, who developed real heat with each other after this match due to the winner's instance that the loser get out of the ring so he could celebrate his win. After that, the two had massive animosity towards each other that burnt for over a decade before they sussed it out. | |
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Face | |
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One of the early face vs. face matches was Pedro Morales vs. Bruno Sammartino for what was then the WWWF Championship, fought at Shea Stadium in September 1972. The setup was that the two faces teamed up for a tag team match against the nefarious Mr. Fuji and Professor Toru Tanaka, the WWWF Tag Team Champions, for the titles. Sammartino and Morales were about to finish off Tanaka when Fuji snuck out of the ring, grabbed some salt and threw it into both opponents' eyes ... and the amazing thing is, Sammartino and Morales began fighting with each other, thinking the other was either Fuji or Tanaka (who had long since left the ring, laughing at what was going on in the ring). Later, both were told what happened and while they weren't happy with what happened, they also felt they had to settle something between them. A rare face vs. face match was commissioned; in fact, this feud was one of those rare times where the "one of the faces becomes a heel" was completely averted, as both continued competing as faces, as normal, in the build-up to their match. Naturally, both wrestlers – who remained faces throughout the match – showed some outstanding mat and power wrestling, and eventually the match ended in a 65-minute draw; only then did both wrestlers make up and truly bury the hatchet. | |
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The Rock vs Hulk Hogan, although in a special case, Hulk's popularity was so great that the Rock turned heel mid-match, only to turn back afterwards. Hulk Hogan was supposed to be Heel in that match as a member of the nWo but did not get booed. After the match when he shook The Rock's hand and both fought off Kevin Nash and Scott Hall, meaning he was officially being booked as a "good guy" from that point on, soon to return to his classic ketchup-and-mustard ringwear and "Real American" entrance music. | |
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The 2019 rivalry between La Formula and La Potencia in WWC. "Feud" would be too strong a word, they just had a lot of fights over who would have a Tag Team title shot at Doom Patrol and or Ilegal Chicano and Xic Xavant when the disfunctional duo beat them both to Doom Patrol and won the belts. Chicano and Xavant themselves were an example, as they did not trust one another and only continued to tag because they kept winning. When Doom Patrol won the belts back Chicano and Xavant finally had the brawl and grudge match everyone knew was coming but it remained fights between good guys who happened to dislike each other with minimal cheating or even disrespect. And the whole time Formula and Potencia were going at it, much to the amusement of heels La Revolucion and Wizard, who tried less physical means to get title shots (though the baby faces still ended up involved in those matches to prevent evil versus evil, Doom Patrol also being heels). | |
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The following is a list of statements referring to the current page from other pages.
| Avengers vs. X-Men / Comicbook | seeAlso |
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Villain with Good Publicity / int_db707f6d |
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