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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization
- 272 statements
- 51 feature instances
- 145 referencing feature instances
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An excuse for rape, used by a character. Used in at least three situations: When a rapist denies that his/her actions can be classified as rape because the victim climaxed. This ignores the physiological fact that orgasm is as much a function of sufficient nerve stimulation as anything else. When a rape is occurring, and the victim first protests and then starts having fun. When a character is raped until they like it and can't get enough of it. There are real people who believe these things make rape into not-rape, or at least make it excusable. The law doesn't see it that way, and a person whose morals really justify violating a person's consent for fun is hardly moral at all, never mind how the victim feels. Do not confuse with "rape fantasy", which is exactly that - a fantasy situation acted out by two (or more) parties with mutual consent. This trope is about the situation where the rapist and/or outsiders deny that it was a rape at all, because the victim became physically aroused or climaxed. Just because someone is into this kind of fantasy roleplay does not mean they are "asking for it." Unfortunately, this trope will often lead to Double Standard Rape: Female on Male. Turns up often in Hentai, Boys' Love Genre and Fanfiction. A lot. |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_1364b6a7 | type |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_1364b6a7 | comment |
One of the most disconcerting parts about Push: Precious recalls her father raping her and vividly remembers enjoying it in parts, despite the awful shame and self-loathing that came with it (not to mention the two pregnancies). | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_190c6ef5 | comment |
Also shows up in Doctor Zhivago: | |
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In Fever Dreams Misa seems to think so when she assaults Light in front of his mother and sister. | |
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Hidoku Shinaide: Once Akira guesses that Maya and Nemugasa are sleeping together, Nemugasa confesses to Akira that Maya's actually been blackmailing him into sex and forcing himself on him. Maya later confronts Nemugasa about this at school and tells Nemugasa that he should've lied and said they were dating. Nemugasa replies that he could never say that because he doesn't even want to be sleeping with Maya in the first place. Maya, enraged, forces himself on Nemugasa. After they both finish, Maya says "And you still want to tell me you don't like it" to a tearful Nemugasa. | |
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Rescue Me's third season episode "Sparks" features Tommy in an argument with his ex-wife over the ownership of some property, all of which Tommy insists are his and basically tells his ex-wife "You're mine", and forces himself on her, she fights for a while but eventually enjoys it. Cue outrage. | |
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It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia: In the episode "The Nightman Cometh" this rationalization makes up the plot of the song "Nightman," but don't try to tell Charlie that.note [[ http://itsalwayssunny.wikia.com/wiki/The_Nightman_Cometh source]] | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_26fa0aa7 | comment |
In Lust, Caution, the heroine ends up falling in love with the man she's been ordered to sleep with and whose idea of intimacy is to take her by force. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_33a61b13 | comment |
Near the end of One Hundred Years of Solitude, the latest Aureliano is unable to cope with his attraction to Amaranta Ursula, who is his aunt and who he believes to be his sister, and rapes her while her husband is in the other room. She tries to fight him off at first, but ends up enjoying it so much that her feelings of love are transferred from her husband over to him. | |
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The Night Unfurls: Vault "reassures" Maia that she needn't worry about being a Sex Slave under his empire, because she will enjoy it. This is John Mandeville's response to Kyril after he tells him that his daughter Chloe can do whatever she wishes to him for the torment she suffered thanks to him. |
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In the Hanzo the Razor trilogy of films (starring Shintaro Katsu of the Zatoichi series), the titular policeman interrogates women by raping them until they cannot refuse telling him whatever he wants to know. | |
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In Revenge of the Nerds, Lewis (a nerd) commits Rape by Fraud against head-cheerleader Betty by disguising himself as her mean boyfriend, Stan (the quarterback). He reveals himself to her immediately after, she is so overwhelmed by Lewis's sexual expertise that she falls in love with him. This was lampshaded in Robot Chicken. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_3ddf6764 | comment |
Deconstructed in Sakura Gari, where we get to see the psychological consequences that such a trope brings on the victim - and arguably, even on the rapist. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_3defe34c | comment |
This trope is often discussed on Law & Order: Special Victims Unit, especially when there are male rape victims. "Arousal is not consent", or words to that effect, are often heard in these situations. Specific examples include: When three female white collar workers are accused of raping a male stripper. Lots of politics get flung around at the bail hearing, until the judge declares that women's rights have moved forward enough for women to also take responsibility as potential sexual predators. There's another episode where a man is raped by another man and doesn't want his girlfriend to know about it because he climaxed. |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_444f7f18 | comment |
Subverted in Kushiel's Legacy. Several times, Phedre has been placed in situations where she has been forced into sex with another person. She mentions the worst part of the experience is always the humiliation of enjoying it. | |
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In Monty Python's Life of Brian, after Brian discovers his father was a Roman: | |
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From the Discworld: | |
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Perhaps most controversially used in Sam Peckinpah's Straw Dogs, in which the unfulfilled wife of a nebbish professor is raped by her brawny former boyfriend and, midway through, begins to enjoy it due to her lingering affection for the man. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_491caeb1 | comment |
Embric of Wulfhammer's Castle sees the Duchess raped by a woman; she acknowledges that it was rape, and does accuse Carmina of raping her, but the fact that she enjoyed it (and doesn't mind describing it in erotic detail for her maid to arouse herself with later) is just one of the mitigating factors involved. | |
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A borderline case occurs in Unfaithful (the American remake of "La Femme infidèle"); wife Connie Sumner (Diane Lane) is walking out on Paul Martel (Olivier Martinez) to stop her affections from developing further. Martel angrily chases her out of his apartment, slams her against the wall, and starts forcibly kissing and groping her. She struggles at first, then quickly submits to her infidelity. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_503d3d54 | comment |
In The Rocky Horror Picture Show, Frank N. Furter sleeps with both Brad and Janet. To do this, he disguises himself as the other character and gets frisky. When the disguises come off, they initially object, then give in. | |
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In Dreamscape, people have the ability to visit other people's dreamworlds while they're asleep by way of psychic abilities. Alex uses this trope as his rationalization for covertly inserting himself into Jane's dreams to make her think she was having a sex fantasy about him, rather than making out with the real life person. The fact that she enjoyed herself doesn't negate the fact that he just basically raped her (Mind Rape?), as she was in no position to give informed consent. | |
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In High Plains Drifter, the third thing Clint Eastwood's character does after riding into town is to drag off a woman who was harassing him and force himself on her. Halfway through the act she starts kissing him enthusiastically. Later she comes after him with a gun—according to the other characters she was angry because he "didn't come back for more", but given how awful the townspeople are it's debatable how true this statement is. | |
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Sort of experienced by George in With Strings Attached, when Fi'ar doses him with Lust Dust and he leaps on her. Later, safely away from her and her vengeful mother, he decides she effectively raped him, except he remembers the brief experience as enjoyable, which annoys him. Ultimately he decides he has more important things to worry about. | |
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Cracker had a discussion something along the lines of | |
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Invoked in the Hurog series by Patricia Briggs, Ward is very uncomfortable discussing what happened to him while he was a prisoner. Another character reassures him that he shouldn't feel guilty or question his sexuality; rape is rape, no matter if his body enjoyed it or not. | |
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Speak: Andy Evans pulls this on Melinda in The Climax, right before trying to rape her. Again. This time, she kicks his ass. | |
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In Black Butler, episode 17, Sebastian does it on a nun named Matilda. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_5eb99c57 | comment |
Ana has a number of orgasms during the rape in Chapter 12 of Fifty Shades of Grey. This is presented as equalling consent. Apparently Ana's unaware that orgasm can happen during rape—or that it doesn't mean that you've consented to anything. This is also Christian Grey's rationalization in Chapter 16 after he spanks and then screws Ana as punishment for daring to roll her eyes at him, despite Ana telling him repeatedly that, whatever her physical response, she "didn't like it" and "would rather that [he] didn't do it again." | |
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A similar discussion is seen near the end of Titus Andronicus, ending in The Reveal via the Tragic Hero casually killing his daughter. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_7b6c4921 | comment |
This is literally the rapist Dean's defense when Paige Michalchuk sues him for rape in Degrassi: The Next Generation. | |
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| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_87684a93 | comment |
In Danganronpa Another Episode: Ultra Despair Girls, Kotoko intends to force herself on Komaru and puts her in a torture device that continually gropes her until she likes it. In the Non-Standard Game Over, a blushing Komaru states she "doesn't hate it" and Kotoko tells the player "Access beyond this point is prohibited, so... Game Over!" | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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A weird example in another King book, The Waste Lands. An incubus doesn't want to rape Susannah if she's enjoying it. At first it overpowers her and forces itself upon her painfully, but when she pretends to like it, it tries to get away. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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One of the Ask That Guy segments had the question "If you rape a prostitute, is it rape or just theft?". He claims that he raped a prostitute and was charged for both crimes, with his defense being that she enjoyed it just as much as he did. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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Tylin to Mat in The Wheel of Time. A truly horrifying example in which the victim keeps on seeking help from his (female) friends who are awesomely powerful mages that owe him their lives... and they laugh at him, telling him he "deserves" to be repeatedly raped (for offenses which include having been a flirt in his teenage years, and the aforementioned saving their lives). It is only after he has had a personal breakdown from these events, recovered from it, escaped (saving his ingrateful alleged "friends" once again), and several other events have happened that someone gives the women in question a What the Hell, Hero? speech and makes them apologize... which they use as simply another opportunity to insult Mat. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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The defense used by the people who run the Dollhouse in Dollhouse is that when Actives are sent on romantic engagements, they genuinely love the clients and willingly have sex with them, having no idea that they've been hired out rather than being in long-term relationships with the clients or that their own memories and personalities are constructs. Agent Ballard disagrees, of course, and feels terrible about sleeping with Mellie after learning that she's an Active. He also refuses to have sex with Echo, a self-aware Active who has integrated her imprint personalities, because he doesn't think it's right while her original personality, Caroline, is still missing. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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In Rob Roy, Archie (the villain) is speculating on various possible fathers, one of whom "lifted [his mother's] skirts at a masque ball." When Archie's girlfriend, shocked, replies "He ravished her?" Archie simply says "I would put it no higher than surprise." Later on, when Archie rapes the hero's wife, Brian Cox shows up to tell her that it doesn't count as a sin (of adultery) if she didn't enjoy it. Even further on, Archie taunts Rob by musing if Mary enjoyed it somewhat. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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In Yosuga no Sora, Nao rapes Haruka while they're young teens. Afterwards she begins putting her clothes back on, while he's still sort of on his back apparently not knowing what to do. Later he chases after her, and although she feels ashamed, he tells her he enjoyed it. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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The Neverwinter Nights mod series The Bastard of Kosigan has a couple of scenes that can play out this way. If the player has a high enough Charisma and chooses the violent rape option with Diane in the forest north of Cologne, the following text is something along the lines of "she is a lot less reluctant than she should be." | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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In Recently, My Sister Is Unusual, the ghost Hiyori Kotobuki often possesses Mitsuki Kanzaki and forces her to masturbate or hit on her own brother Yuya. Sometimes, Hiyori will kiss, fondle, and molest Mitsuki (since Mitsuki can feel her) no matter how many times she says, "Stop" or tries to resist. Mitsuki complains about this a lot. Unconcerned, Hiyori points out that deep down inside, she enjoyed it. Mitsuki will blush and admit it is true. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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Discussed in the first episode of Crownies by two of the prosecutors. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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In Happy Yarou Wedding, Kazuki is determined that two men can't have a real relationship and considers his brother-in-law's reaction to being molested by him as proof, never mind Yuuhi's protests. Later on in the series it become clear why this was such an issue for him. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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Carrie: Margaret crudely tells Carrie how she was produced via rape because Margaret considered all sex — even within marriage — to be offensive and sinful. She starts screaming about how she admits she enjoyed it. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_bbcdaddc | comment |
In Maria no Danzai, after Maria puts him in a Drowning Pit and he realizes that she intends to kill him, Kowase assumes that this is retribution for all the crap he's put Yashima through and starts running his mouth to downplay the bullying and the blackmail, but more specifically he asserts that he and Yashima were just fooling around (they weren't), that he only got a little carried away because Yashima didn't put up any resistance and that, if she had really disliked it, then she would've put up more of a fight. Therefore, since she didn't fight back, then "that's evidence that it's not such a big deal". Maria, who's actually after Kowase for reasons completely unrelated to Yashima, simply tells him to shut up. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_bf63db6f | comment |
Invoked in Wolf Guy - Wolfen Crest. While he and his Yakuza goons are gang-raping Aoshika-sensei, Haguro Dou forcibly gives her a Psycho Serum that causes her to physically enjoy herself, in an attempt to break her further than he already has. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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The Killer Inside Me: Joyce starts hitting Lou, Lou hits her back, and then shoves her down on the bed and starts beating her with his belt. It's awful... until he apologizes, looking shocked at himself, and she tells him it's OK and kisses him. They then begin an S&M relationship. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_c715f539 | comment |
In the Outlander series. Jack Randall purposefully alternates between brutal sadism and romantic attentions, in an attempt to elicit a physical response from his male victim, and he succeeds. Jamie is left disturbed, confused, and furious. In another example, with a female making the advances and without the sadism, Geilis quite clearly takes advantage of Ian during Voyager. Other characters seem ambivalent about this, in what appears to be Deliberate Values Dissonance. |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_cba3559b | comment |
In Survival of the Fittest Version 3, Adam Reeves attempts to justify his rape of Maxie Dasai by asserting that her body's arousal meant that she was into it. It's left ambiguous, but strongly implied that he brought her to orgasm (Reeves himself certainly thought so). He is the only one that thought it was okay. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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In Picket Fences, a woman rapes a man, and the police are a bit confused, also pointing out that he did climax himself. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_efff2c4c | comment |
In the Fritz the Cat story "Fritz the No-Good", Fritz rapes the girlfriends of one of the revolutionaries in the story. However, she actually enjoys it. This trope reoccurs in "Fritz the Cat, Superstar", where Fritz throws himself on a fan and she doesn't seem to object much, only commenting "wow, man, you're too much". | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
| "Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization / int_f5cf3f9a | comment |
In Gone with the Wind, Rhett Butler rapes his wife Scarlett, but the next day she's blushing blissfully about it. This also counts as Values Dissonance since the idea of marital rape being a crime is a very new concept and was not around at the time the book or movie were made. | |
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"Not If They Enjoyed It" Rationalization | |
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The Phantom of the Opera alludes to this. There has been much debate over what happens between Christine and the Phantom after the lights go out at the conclusion of "Music Of The Night"—and if there WAS sex, it would be rape, as Christine was alternately unconscious/in a trance at the time. When Christine describes the encounter to Raoul, she states that though she is terrified of the Phantom, she is equally drawn to him by his beautiful music. There's also debate over whether the Phantom is even physically capable of having sex. | |
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